Skip to content
 
 

[00:00:00.00] [MUSIC PLAYING]

[00:00:04.13] REID HOLZWORTH: Welcome to the Insurance Technology Podcast. I'm your host, Reid Holzworth. Joining me today is world famous Mr. Bradley Flowers, co-host of the Insurance Guys Podcast and president of Portal Insurance. What's up, my man? How you doing?

[00:00:19.20] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Man, I'm good. I'm really happy to finally get to do this with you. Big fan. Big fan of you and all you do. So anytime I can sit down with somebody I respect, I'm always happy to do that.

[00:00:32.40] REID HOLZWORTH: I appreciate that, man. Well, I appreciate you and everything you do for this industry. You're a real industry dude, man. And so I'm looking forward to this one. We're going to let the audience really get to know you in a lot of ways.

[00:00:43.32] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Awesome.

[00:00:43.70] REID HOLZWORTH: So before we get into all that fun stuff we call "insurance" around here, tell us a little bit about yourself. Where did you grow up? What were you into? What did you want to be when you grew up? Start there.

[00:00:55.51] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, so I grew up in a little town called Atmore, Alabama. We were known for two things. We were the only place in the world where there was a legit casino-- like what you would see in Vegas-- less than a mile from a maximum security prison that held death row inmates. That's the two things Atmore, Alabama is known for.

[00:01:23.33] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:01:25.78] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So anytime I dated someone that did not live there, the dad would always ask, you weren't in prison, were you? That's not why you lived in Atmore, right?

[00:01:33.88] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS] Do you still get that?

[00:01:36.67] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And you're not a degenerate gambler, right?

[00:01:38.53] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:01:41.17] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So yeah, I grew up there and went to high school there. I had 22 people in my graduating class.

[00:01:46.77] REID HOLZWORTH: Wow.

[00:01:47.17] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And most of the 22 of us were in the same class. I think about half of the 22 people, we went K-4 to 12th grade.

[00:01:58.90] REID HOLZWORTH: Wow.

[00:01:59.47] BRADLEY FLOWERS: All together, yeah. I don't talk to any of them anymore.

[00:02:02.84] REID HOLZWORTH: I thought to actually ask you that. Yeah, are you still friends with your high school pals or your school pals?

[00:02:07.52] BRADLEY FLOWERS: There's one guy that I talk to. He actually worked at Portal for a little while. But our relationship now is we send memes back and forth to each other.

[00:02:16.26] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:02:17.15] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So that's on Instagram. That's what we do.

[00:02:19.81] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS] So what was family life like?

[00:02:24.09] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It was good, man. My dad was a small business owner. He was a contractor. My mom did his books. Classic mom and pop deal. So my mom's dad owned a barber shop that my brother actually owns and runs today.

[00:02:42.92] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, nice.

[00:02:43.64] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And my dad's dad was like a quintessential natural born salesman, hustler, could-sell-ice-to-an-Eskimo-- that whole vernacular. And so I was sort of raised around, for lack of a better term, entrepreneur. I think entrepreneur is one of those words if you call yourself that, you're probably not one. But--

[00:03:09.30] REID HOLZWORTH: Dude, it's so funny. It's such a true thing. I hate saying that now because it's like you say that to somebody and they're like, yeah. That means you're like a loser.

[00:03:19.27] BRADLEY FLOWERS: They automatically picture the rented Lambo or private jet movie set on Instagram. But sometimes it gets to a point, like that's the best way to describe it. But yeah, it's--

[00:03:31.59] REID HOLZWORTH: It's so true.

[00:03:32.00] BRADLEY FLOWERS: --like calling yourself a thought leader. You ain't one, you know?

[00:03:35.66] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:03:37.14] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But I grew up around these small town, small business, business owner, entrepreneur/salesman guys. I remember the first time I ever talked on a landline. My grandfather ran a mobile home dealership, which is very Alabama of him. And he taught me how to answer the phone and, basically, take care of customers to some degree.

[00:04:01.68] REID HOLZWORTH: That's cool.

[00:04:03.15] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So I was just sort of around it. And it was interesting like my mom-- and my parents aren't going to listen to this, more than likely. But like my mom always sort of hated the fact that my dad owned his own business because there's stresses and struggles that come with that. You know what I mean?

[00:04:19.23] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah.

[00:04:19.99] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And so my parents-- I often heard like, get a job, get a job, get a job, get a job. Don't own your own business. It sucks, which it does for a lot of people.

[00:04:31.94] And I was listening to a podcast yesterday. Actually, it was Dave Ramsey, his EntreLeadership podcast, which is great. And this business owner called in and she's like, my lowest paid employee made more money than I did last year. And sometimes, in those small businesses, you deal with that. So that was sort of beaten in my head. Don't.

[00:04:50.23] But then all I saw were these guys and gals running their own businesses and selling stuff. And so it was like, that's all I really wanted to do. You know what I mean? So I think it was just-- this is going to sound cliche, but it kind of like built into my DNA a little bit.

[00:05:08.02] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. Wow.

[00:05:09.15] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I also don't like being told what to do. And if you don't like being told what to do, working for somebody else usually is not going to work out.

[00:05:15.71] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS] So what was your favorite hobby sport? Do you play sports when you were a kid?

[00:05:22.27] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I'm going to throw you a curveball. So from the age of 11 to 15, I was a competitive bull rider.

[00:05:33.76] REID HOLZWORTH: What? Dude, that's bad ass. Really?

[00:05:37.74] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You would never know the guy that wear skinny jeans and Air Force 1's--

[00:05:41.34] REID HOLZWORTH: That is legit. That is so bad ass, for real.

[00:05:44.24] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I literally did that. I've got photos I can show you, traveled all over the Southeast. The guy that I traveled with actually made it to the BBR.

[00:05:52.76] REID HOLZWORTH: Whoa.

[00:05:53.96] BRADLEY FLOWERS: He was a little bit better than me, but he just kept doing it. And all of a sudden, you start seeing people get hurt and paralyzed or killed.

[00:06:06.64] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:06:07.18] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I had a couple buddies that I wasn't super close to, but guys I knew that got killed. And this is like high school rodeo.

[00:06:15.08] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:06:15.53] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I remember my buddy that I traveled with, his dad was a professional bull rider and he was sort of like our mentor. And my grandfather did that as well. So my dad actually encouraged me to do it. My mother freaks out any time I'm on an airplane. How, to this day, that she let me do that, I will never know.

[00:06:35.03] And I remember I went to my friend's house and his dad was showing me a picture of all these professional bull riders. And he's like, yeah, he's dead. He's paralyzed. He's missing some fingers. And I was like, man, I don't know if this is what I need to be doing.

[00:06:50.78] And I ended up getting hurt. I was at a bull riding thing and there was a girl there that I was like chatting up and I fell off of a bull. And when you fall off of a bull, the number one rule is you don't get hung up in your rope. If you get hung up in your rope, the number one rule is don't lose your feet. Stand up and run with the bull.

[00:07:19.95] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, OK. So you don't get dragged and then trampled.

[00:07:23.15] BRADLEY FLOWERS: If you lose your feet, you do whatever you can to not go under the bull. That's how you get killed. Most people get killed bull riding not-- everybody's scared of the horns. It's the feet. That's how you getting stepped on. That's how you get killed.

[00:07:36.91] REID HOLZWORTH: I could see it.

[00:07:37.61] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And so that happened. I went under the bull. He ripped my pants off. There's blood running down my legs. And I happened to be wearing Whitey tighties. And it was right in front of where that chick was sitting.

[00:07:54.03] [LAUGHTER]

[00:07:56.33] The bad part is, I was actually leading the competition. I actually completed the ride before. And I got off weird, and that's what caused it to happen. And so I think I rode like one more time after that. And I was like, yeah, I'm not doing this anymore.

[00:08:12.35] So I went to skateboarding. I started skateboarding. So I was the skater kid, like early high school.

[00:08:19.91] REID HOLZWORTH: Like pools and ramps or street skate stuff?

[00:08:23.78] BRADLEY FLOWERS: A little bit of both. A little bit of both. And then I stopped that around 16, and then I took up golf. So I got safer and safer with my hobbies.

[00:08:35.31] I remember my neighbor, actually, the guy with the cigar, came over to my dad's house one time, and I had a skate ramp in the backyard. And he's like, man, I'm beginning to think you have some really good life insurance on your kids because you just keep putting them in sports that they're going to bust their butt in, like bull riding, skateboarding.

[00:08:52.50] But then I eventually made my way to golf. I love golf. Played golf all throughout high school. Actually, I was telling David Cruthers the other day-- no, it was somebody-- Josh Gurley.

[00:09:02.75] From 2007 to-- no, it was 2006 to 2012. I played golf every single day. I did not go one day-- rain, snow, hurricane, every single day. I was obsessed with it. And I ended up playing in college a little bit, played some after college, and now, I never play. I got it out of my system, so to speak.

[00:09:29.06] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, going back to the skateboarding thing. So a lot of people don't know this. My brother was actually a professional skateboarder. And

[00:09:35.80] BRADLEY FLOWERS: OK.

[00:09:36.08] REID HOLZWORTH: And he was sponsored by-- this is way in the 90s whatnot but-- Vision, Independent, and Alva and all those guys. And as a kid, I skated too. But I was just like a little grom. They just all pick on me and make me do dumb stuff, but it was fun.

[00:09:50.79] But anyways, I'd go to Tony Alva's shop and we'd go there and they'd just like, get whatever you want. And as a kid, you get clothes and decks and whatever. It was so awesome, man.

[00:10:00.54] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:10:00.86] REID HOLZWORTH: But my neighbor up the street, his name was Jesse Roach, he was a professional skater too. And these guys, they all skated together like Christian Hosoi and Tony Hawk and all these guys. But there was one professional skater like, for real, for real, that everybody knows, right? It's Tony Hawk.

[00:10:16.35] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:10:16.70] REID HOLZWORTH: Anyways, this kid up the street from me, Jesse, he had a big half pipe with real vert, dude. It was badass. And he actually did a commercial with Michael Jordan when we were kids. And it was a Super Bowl commercial.

[00:10:32.81] Michael Jordan's dribbling the ball, and Jesse-- this is like the Nike pumps. I don't know if you remember those. He pumps up his shoes, like the pumps. And then he jumps on the skateboard and he rides by and Michael Jordan's dribbling. He steals the ball from Jordan and he hits the quarterpipe and then he dunks the ball over Jordan.

[00:10:51.06] And, dude, he was like my neighborhood kid. He got rich off of that because every time that commercial played, he got a royalty from it. It was pretty wild.

[00:11:01.63] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, so Jamie Thomas is from Alabama. Jamie Thomas was huge in the early 2000. Remember the company Zero, with the skull? That was his. He was a big part of that.

[00:11:14.56] And so Pensacola, which isn't far from me, has a pretty big skate culture there. And Tony Hawk had been there a few times, and done-- when he was doing that-- there was the Huck Jam Tour and then the Secret Skatepark Tour, which was the cooler one, where they would just show up at a random skatepark in BFE and Tony Hawk was there. And I remember Tony was there and the crowd was yelling, 900, 900, 900, which was right after he had landed a nine-- this was like '03 maybe.

[00:11:47.23] REID HOLZWORTH: So wild.

[00:11:47.89] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And he did the 999. And the ramp, Reid, this was the biggest ramp I'd ever seen in my life. It's huge.

[00:11:57.70] And he said on the recording on the show once it was produced, said, the ramp wasn't big enough to do a 900. So he did a 720, and people thought it was a 900 because it's hard to count them. And people just went nuts thinking he did his second 900 because he had only done the one at that time. And so he said on the show, from now on, he's calling the 720, the Pensacola 900.

[00:12:20.25] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, that's awesome.

[00:12:21.44] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But I'll tell you, man, of the three things I've done, the skating is probably the most deep in my soul or in my heart. Because if I'm driving down the road and I see somebody playing golf, I'm like, yeah, that's cool. Whatever. If I see somebody like-- not that you would see somebody riding a bull down the road, but if I see like-- but when you see somebody on a skate, I'm always turning my head, trying to like-- you know what I mean?

[00:12:49.22] There's nothing like driving through downtown, any city, and you hear that "click clack" of a skateboard. It's soothing. You know what I mean? That was the thing that I probably enjoyed the most. Because golf-- I turned golf into a job. And then bull riding was just so freaking dangerou. You were just so anxious you couldn't really even enjoy. You know what I mean?

[00:13:17.50] And of course I played football, baseball growing up, that sort of thing. But I've always been the type to go against the grain of what everybody else is doing a little bit. You know what I mean? I like to do my own thing. I don't know. And even now, in the insurance industry, if you walk into our office, you wouldn't think it was an insurance agency based on the way it looks, the way the people are dressed. It's just always been sort of my vibe to be a yin to the yang. You know what I mean?

[00:13:47.63] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally. Totally. What was something difficult you had to deal with as a kid, if I may ask? Getting a little deeper there.

[00:13:55.88] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Man, it might be getting a little personal. I've never told this story. When I was in the fifth grade, I almost died. Not from a bull, actually. [CHUCKLES]

[00:14:07.08] I had a allergic reaction to an allergy shot and literally, like, throat closed up-- exactly how you would imagine in the movies. I still remember it today. They didn't have an EpiPen. The doctor just had the wherewithal to put Benadryl in my vein.

[00:14:32.07] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, wow.

[00:14:32.52] BRADLEY FLOWERS: They couldn't get the needle in the vein. It was super dramatic. My mom handled it pretty well. It was just me and my mom there, and I stayed in intensive care. Staying in intensive care as a fifth grader is pretty scary.

[00:14:50.02] But I remember when I was in intensive care in the middle of the night, they wouldn't let me sleep on my stomach, which they don't like you to do that when you're in the hospital. And I rolled over and the heart monitor came off and it coded. And the doctors came running in and I was like, no, I just pulled it off. But that happened. And I think that was pretty tough to get over. I think that created a lot of anxiety early on.

[00:15:17.62] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:15:18.22] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And then my grandfather passed away around that time, so I was exposed to death earlier. I've got an 11-year-old. I won't let her go to a funeral. I'm like, if I can prevent-- you know what I mean? So I don't know. That's probably two of the toughest things I've dealt with growing up.

[00:15:39.56] But I mean, really, other than that, dude, I had awesome childhood, pretty strict parents, but they let me have a lot of fun. And my parents weren't rich by any means, but owning their own business, there was some good years in there. We got to do some fun stuff, and that sort of thing. And my kids have it way better than I did, which I think is everybody's goal to some degree.

[00:16:05.26] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome, man.

[00:16:05.86] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You ask good questions.

[00:16:07.22] REID HOLZWORTH: Thank you. Thank you. No, that's tough, dude. I can't imagine dealing with that at that age. I mean, it's got to put a lot of pressure on you, worrying about that, that that could happen again and how easy it was. And like you said, your grandfather-- that happened then. Yeah, that was tough, dude.

[00:16:22.54] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:16:22.70] REID HOLZWORTH: Real tough. Yeah. Wow, all right. Well, on positive note, what do you want to be when you grew up when you were a kid?

[00:16:30.08] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So depending on what age you want to-- I mean, obviously, when I'm skating, I want to be a professional skater. That sort of thing. But I'll tell you an interesting story. We interview a lot of people on our podcast. Everybody says they never wanted to sell insurance.

[00:16:45.99] REID HOLZWORTH: You're not going to tell me that. Come on.

[00:16:47.99] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I was 16 years old, and I was at the point-- and I played a couple of professional tournaments as an amateur. But pretty much the writing on the wall was, I was not going to be a pro golfer.

[00:16:58.77] And being a professional golfer is different than every other sport because, literally, you could say, hey, I'm Reid Holzworth. I'm a pro golfer. You're a pro golfer. That's all you have to do is declare it. You know what I mean?

[00:17:09.78] PGA TOUR is a different thing. But I knew there was no way I could make a career out of it. So I was like, OK, I need to find something else to do that will give me the time to play golf. And so I went to school to be a teacher because I would get summers off, which is the wrong reason to be a teacher, by the way.

[00:17:29.10] But I remember playing golf at 16 years old, and the three guys that I knew-- or two guys that I knew that played the most golf were both insurance agents. Bob Green and Chris Kirk. Shout out to those guys. Bob passed away a few years ago.

[00:17:45.54] And I was like, these guys play golf all the time. They sell-- I'm going to go and do that. And so that was the thing. And now, I never play golf-- literally, never. I turned down an opportunity today to play a really nice course. I just don't have any interest in it.

[00:18:03.22] But yeah, man, as a early teenager, that's what I wanted to be. When I'm younger, it's all over the place, man. You're delusional when you're like 10 years old, and you decide what you want to be when you grow up. I think to some degree, you're delusional when you're 18. I think it's ridiculous that we expect 18-year-olds to pick a major, and that's the thing they're going to do the rest of their life.

[00:18:22.63] REID HOLZWORTH: I agree, man. I agree. But what do you do? It's tough. They got to do something, right?

[00:18:27.68] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Man, I've thought about my daughter. She's going to be going to college in seven years. And man, I think I'm going to encourage her like, unless you want to do like doctor, lawyer, engineer, something super specific, go get a degree that's practical in any industry-- accounting, marketing, that sort of thing. So my biggest regret, honestly, is going to college.

[00:18:51.49] REID HOLZWORTH: Really? Wow.

[00:18:52.60] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So I didn't finish. I quit. I walked out of the classroom because I was going to school to be a teacher. I had made $60,000 in six months selling insurance. Commission only. And the starting pay for a teacher in Alabama at the time was $30,000.

[00:19:07.76] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:19:08.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I looked to my left. And I looked to my right and I'm like, I'm already making four times what these people are going to make when they graduate. Why am I here? I walked out of the classroom, never walked back in, so I didn't finish. So my biggest regret is I wish I either would have not went and started insurance sooner, or I wish I would have finished-- one of those two. And I tend to lead towards just not going at all.

[00:19:30.04] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. My son's 17, and he's really smart, dude. And I'm not just saying that because he's my son. He actually is a very, very smart kid. And he wants to take a year off. He wants to do the whole leap year thing and just figure it out. He wants to go out, travel a bit, and just have a good time, do some road trips and stuff with his buddies. And I'm like, hell yeah, dude, have at it. Figure it out. I like what you said, though, like, pick something that's universal across all industries if you don't really know what you want to do.

[00:19:59.47] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Well, I like the leap year idea as long as it's done with a purpose, and you're not just laying around the house playing video games.

[00:20:06.94] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally. Yeah.

[00:20:08.01] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Because my thing is, in your early 20s, that's when you can take risks. That's when you could screw up, screw around for three years, come back, and, if you really apply yourself, be ahead of most people that are older than you. I've got three kids and a mortgage and all kind of stuff. I can't go travel the world just willy nilly. Or hey, maybe if you have a crazy business idea, maybe you try that for that year.

[00:20:38.86] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally. Yeah.

[00:20:40.52] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Whatever money your parents are going to put into college, let them. Hey, let's fund this business and see what happens. Matter of fact, I think there's some insurance technologies where something similar happened like that.

[00:20:55.40] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. For me, man, I'm kind of envious. When I was a kid, dude, I was just so after it, just so entrepreneurial. I got to crush it. I got to do it. I got to figure this out. Just work, work, work, work. I got married young, I had kids, young.

[00:21:10.80] And then now, you got to work even harder. You got to make sure those bills are paid. You got to build the future for them. So it's cool to have kids, and now, they're starting to get older. I have three kids as well. My oldest is 17 and my daughter is a freshman in high school and my other son's 13. And so--

[00:21:28.82] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You're at the light at the end of the tunnel, brother.

[00:21:30.49] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, 100%. 100%. So it's cool to see that. And then for them, just to have those opportunities, to be able to just chill, and take it easy and figure it out.

[00:21:41.18] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I think everything's a trade off, too. We've got some friends that had kids when they were 17, 18. And now they're--

[00:21:49.93] REID HOLZWORTH: That's really young.

[00:21:50.79] BRADLEY FOWLERS: --they're our age, and they're empty nesters. And they're still young and they're like, this is awesome. But then the flip side is, if you didn't do that, like me and my wife-- I had my daughter when I was like 25, but we didn't have our second son until two, three years ago.

[00:22:10.65] So we had some fun in our 20s. But now, we're going to be 60 years old with-- you know what I mean? So it's like, everything's a trade off, and you can't get it just right, so you just do what you can however the chips fall.

[00:22:26.22] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally. Totally. All right, let's get into your high school life real quick, and then we'll start getting into the meat of some insurance stuff.

[00:22:33.76] BRADLEY FLOWERS: All right.

[00:22:34.27] REID HOLZWORTH: What was your first car?

[00:22:36.27] BRADLEY FLOWERS: My first car was a 1994 Toyota Tacoma.

[00:22:41.68] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, that's a sweet first car.

[00:22:43.72] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, it had 43,000 miles on it when I bought it.

[00:22:48.73] REID HOLZWORTH: Do you still have it?

[00:22:49.71] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I don't. I wish I did. The girl I sold it to totaled it--

[00:22:53.79] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, no.

[00:22:54.24] BRADLEY FLOWERS: --a week later. And I'm about to tell you why she totaled it. I jacked it up, and it had mud tires on it even though it never went in the mud. The big CB whip antenna--

[00:23:06.82] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, nice.

[00:23:07.43] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It was super redneck, dude.

[00:23:08.86] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, that's sick.

[00:23:11.29] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So those old Toyota Tacomas had-- on the back side of it, above the back window, there was a little light that lit up when you hit the brakes. I got a metal plate made that went over it, and it had cut out "yo," which was like a double entendre because "Toyota," but then also, yo, you need to stop.

[00:23:36.94] And I had a brush guard on the front of it. There was a single cab. The reason that you couldn't let the seats all the way back was because I had subwoofers behind the seats.

[00:23:48.65] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS] Yeah. The whole thing.

[00:23:51.05] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I drove with the steering wheel. I built the subwoofer box myself. I used to build subwoofer box for people and sell them. That was one of my first entrepreneurial things I did. But the reason I had 43,000 miles on it is the odometer stopped working five years before. So when I sold it, it had 43,000 miles on it. [LAUGHS]

[00:24:10.42] REID HOLZWORTH: Wow.

[00:24:12.46] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And then I had a tool box on the back that I kept locked because it would fit perfectly a cooler of beer in the back of it. So that was my first ride. And it was a lot more crappy than it sounds like. I dressed it up and made it look good. But that truck was--

[00:24:32.56] REID HOLZWORTH: Those trucks are cool, man. Regardless, those things could be all rusted out and just crap, and they are still cool.

[00:24:37.97] BRADLEY FLOWERS: They run forever, man. My buddy had one that had like 500,000 miles on it.

[00:24:42.25] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah. Cool.

[00:24:43.66] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It would just go. And I sold that truck and bought a-- everybody had a white Z71 at my school, man. That was like the truck. And I sold it and bought this crappy white Z71 that smelled like cigarette smoke. It was just like a terrible truck. I should have kept the Toyota.

[00:25:01.51] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. Yeah. A question for you. In your opinion, what is the best subwoofer?

[00:25:08.71] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So I was always a big Kenwood guy.

[00:25:11.47] REID HOLZWORTH: OK.

[00:25:13.78] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I don't remember the model or anything like that. Kenwoods with a Rockford Fosgate amp in the middle of them. But I'm sure there's better subwoofers out there, but I always rock the Kenwoods. I think I had three or four sets of Kenwoods.

[00:25:27.73] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome.

[00:25:28.41] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:25:29.14] REID HOLZWORTH: We did like kickers. I think the best are kickers Fosgates, but I think the best actually are JLs. They're really expensive, but really good. Anyways, that was back in the day.

[00:25:39.84] BRADLEY FLOWERS: --budget so I think those Kenwoods, I paid like 100 bucks for.

[00:25:42.98] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah. Totally.

[00:25:44.08] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And then the amp, I would burn the amps out every so often. I had to get another one, all that jazz.

[00:25:50.57] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome, man. So all right, what did you do after high school?

[00:25:56.01] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So I went to college. I played golf. It was junior college. I had the same coach as Bubba Watson, actually. Bubba Watson and I went to the same junior college. That was around the time he won the Masters. So that was a big deal then.

[00:26:12.49] But I went to junior college specifically to play golf. I majored in eligibility, which meant I took whatever classes got me eligible.

[00:26:23.76] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:26:25.12] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I quit the golf team about a year in. I was barely good enough to be on it, but I didn't really like the team aspect of it because golf is such an individual sport. And so like, man, I went to college and I played golf. And the course that I grew up on is known as the gambling course. Like, that's where you go if you want to gamble. And--

[00:26:51.94] REID HOLZWORTH: Why?

[00:26:54.67] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Mainly because they let a lot of shit slide.

[00:26:59.66] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, OK.

[00:27:01.36] BRADLEY FLOWERS: One example of that would be, most golf courses will only let you have four to a group. I've played in a 20-some before out there. Like, they'll let you put as many people in as long as you keep up pace of play. They don't care. So you could get eight people in a group and just get these crazy bets going, where everybody's playing everybody.

[00:27:19.46] And so what I would do, man, is I would go to class. My classes lasted 'til mid-afternoon. I would go to the golf course. I would get in a gambling match that afternoon, and then there would always be a poker game that broke out. I'm decent at poker. And so I paid my way through college not-- I didn't pay for my classes, but I paid for my expenses gambling on the golf course and at the card table at that golf course. So I would make $1 to $300 a day sometimes playing golf--

[00:27:56.58] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, wow.

[00:27:59.48] BRADLEY FLOWERS: --and sometimes lose too. But I did that for three years. I remember I went to a class reunion-- or not a reunion, but a bunch of us got together. And a buddy of mine was like, so you just play golf every day after school? He's like, do you have a life? I'm like, I'll make more money than you do.

[00:28:15.76] [LAUGHTER]

[00:28:16.73] I didn't actually say that but I remember, dude, like 20, 21 years old, I had almost five figures stacked up in cash, which is a lot to a 20-year-old.

[00:28:30.17] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah.

[00:28:31.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I thought I was rich. But I did that for a few years and then got into insurance from there.

[00:28:38.39] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome. You already said it. Your first real job was insurance. Talk about that. Right?

[00:28:48.60] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, technically, my first real job, I worked at a golf course.

[00:28:52.56] REID HOLZWORTH: OK.

[00:28:54.87] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I was in charge of the carts and stuff and I would go out and make enough tips to pay for my lunch that day and then go do that. But then after that-- so I went to work locally for a cell phone store, managing-- not managing, but working at a cell phone store.

[00:29:14.55] A buddy of mine was selling insurance at the time and he was like, hey-- this was in college. And I did the cell phone thing for eight months. And he was like, hey, man, if you can sell this, you can sell insurance. Come work with me.

[00:29:26.55] So I went to work for him at Liberty National Life, which I don't recommend doing. And it was like the golf Groundhog's Day. It was like that. You know what I mean? I'm selling life insurance, that sort of thing, door to door. But I really cut my teeth doing those commission only. They had an advanced commission structure so you could make a lot of money really fast.

[00:29:50.59] Not only was insurance something I'd planned on doing or wanted to do, but I liked the fact that I felt like a business professional. It was more like white collar. It wasn't out in the sun.

[00:30:01.68] When I worked with my dad as a teenager, it was horrible. Like, it was not typical dad working for the son. There was no nepotism going on here. I was at the bottom of the-- I was the grunt.

[00:30:11.69] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah, you were the worm.

[00:30:13.24] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, exactly.

[00:30:13.98] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:30:16.08] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, so I started doing that, did really well. I did that for a year, dropped out of college, and then sort of recognized like, hey, P&C is actually where it's at. Because not everyone that I come into contact today is going to buy life insurance, but all of them have P&C insurance as long as they're not homeless.

[00:30:34.00] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally.

[00:30:34.38] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Literally. And that's what I tell new hires here. We have a rooftop patio up here. I take them to the top of the building and I'll say, every building you can see is insured. Every car you can see is insured. Every ship you can see is insured. Every truck you can see is insured.

[00:30:49.34] And so I recognized that P&C was where it's at. So I quit Liberty National, went to work for a State Farm agent who was the leading guy here in the area for P&C at the time. And because I really wanted to learn P&C-- and my salary there was $15,000 a year, and I had a kid on the way.

[00:31:11.13] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, wow.

[00:31:13.50] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It was an internship. I tell people, I love when I get a young kid. If I was to talk to your oldest son-- young kids today tend to think that success is linear. You're going to go from here, and then you're going to go from here, and you're going to-- when in reality, it's like this.

[00:31:33.36] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:31:34.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You probably know that better than anybody.

[00:31:36.58] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:31:37.37] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And sometimes, you got to take a step back to move forward. And it's the people who always constantly want to move forward that end up getting stuck in a dead end job where they're making $70k. and I've got to stay for the health insurance because they didn't take risks when they were younger. You know what I mean? So I did that for a little while and ended up liking it, I think. So

[00:32:01.98] REID HOLZWORTH: Did you sell life insurance as well or just P&C at State Farm?

[00:32:05.25] BRADLEY FLOWERS: They hired me because I had a life insurance background. So I did P&C and life. But really, I really wanted to learn P&C.

[00:32:11.86] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:32:13.21] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Because, I mean, everybody buys it. I was, thankfully, as a dumb 20 something year old, recognized at least that. Everybody's buying home and car insurance, you know?

[00:32:22.84] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. That's awesome, man. So then, what happened? So State Farm, then what?

[00:32:27.53] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So I did that for a year. There's a regional carrier here in Alabama called Alfa Insurance. A-L-F-A. They're essentially Alabama's version of Farm Bureau. They had a really nice comp structure. A really nice-- they set you up like you own your own agency but you don't. So that company gave a lot of liberties, a lot of benefits that business owners would have. And so I liked the idea of that. I was ready to make some money. So a year after State Farm, I quit and went to work at Alfa.

[00:33:05.05] And it was serendipitous, actually, how it happened. I don't know that I've told this story ever. So I was trying to get hired on at Alfa, and I didn't know anybody there. And I kept filling out the apply for a job for them on the website. Well, I didn't know that Alfa is horrible with technology. And their form was broken, so they didn't get any of my applications. And I couldn't. You know, whatever. So I was still at State Farm.

[00:33:31.99] So my dad had a water claim. He had a water heater that leaked, and it ruined a wood floor. And he called me. He's like, hey, the adjuster's coming over. Would you mind coming over here? And just like, you're in the insurance business. I'm like, sure. So the adjuster comes by, and I was like, should I say something to him?

[00:33:49.78] And he had Alfa. Should I say something to him? Nah, I'm not going to say anything. So the guy comes and he leaves. And then five minutes later, he comes back and he says, I've been adjusting for 34 years, and I have never forgotten to take photos of a claim and I just did that at your house. I need to take photos. And so I was like, hey, man, while I got you here.

[00:34:12.81] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, wow.

[00:34:15.30] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I mean, I've been trying to get hired on. I've been trying to get in touch. I wasn't as resourceful back then, Reid, as I am now. Now I'd be like, let's go to LinkedIn. Let's figure out.

[00:34:23.59] REID HOLZWORTH: How was it? How was it?

[00:34:24.43] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah. And I really didn't grow up with technology, and so I didn't really know social media then either. And he was like, yeah, let me find out who you need to talk to. And the next day, he gave me my future boss's name. I called him, and I started with the company a month later.

[00:34:42.98] And so had he not-- and by the way, the reason I met my wife was because her office was next door to my Alfa office. So had that dude not forgotten to take photos of that claim for the first time in 34 years, I might not be married to the person I'm married to now, which is wild to think about.

[00:34:59.97] REID HOLZWORTH: It's so crazy. It's almost like, was it supposed to happen? Would he have taken those photos if you would have asked him initially?

[00:35:08.30] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Right, right.

[00:35:08.73] REID HOLZWORTH: Right? Or was it just the universe? Not to get super deep on this, just like, wait, nope, nope, you're not done here. You got to go back. And you were like, all right, I'm going to do it now. And look at what it did.

[00:35:20.56] BRADLEY FLOWERS: To even add something to that. So there was two offices that I could go to when I was being hired there. They wanted to give me the option of two offices. My boss wanted me to go to Saraland, which was the one that I ended up going to. But I wanted to go to this other one that was in a town called Bay Minette because it was closer to my house. And he's like, do me a favor, go to the Bay Minette office and talk to-- so in Alfa, you share an office with another principal.

[00:35:49.34] He's like, go talk to that guy. And I talk to him for five minutes. And I was like, this guy is a psychopath. I do not want to work with this person. He ended up getting fired later because he brought a gun to the office.

[00:35:59.72] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[00:36:01.38] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And so I called him in the parking lot, my boss, and I was like, hey, man, I want to go to Saraland. He's like, so you talk to this guy for five minutes? I was like, that's exactly what happened.

[00:36:09.19] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[00:36:09.94] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So even then it was like, not to get religious, but it's like the Lord was pushing me to like-- I would have never met my wife then. So it was so many little things that happened. Not to be super evangelical about my career because I think I'm a speck on a horse's butt in the grand scheme of things.

[00:36:28.47] But there was a lot of little things like that happened that led me to where I am now. And it's crazy to think about that. And I think we all have that to some degree, you know?

[00:36:38.92] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, right.

[00:36:39.65] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You probably have early TechCanary stuff, that if this one thing wouldn't happen, you know?

[00:36:45.20] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally. So 100%. That's awesome. So then, how long did you do that? Then what happened?

[00:36:51.73] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I was there for 6 and 1/2 years. At the time, it was the best thing for me because it gave me-- It was like practice for being a business owner, you know?

[00:37:01.22] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:37:01.73] BRADLEY FLOWERS: A lot of stuff I could do that I couldn't do if I just worked for somebody. I really learned marketing there, I really learned social media there. I had a boss. Unfortunately, our relationship did not end great when I quit. But he really understood that I needed to be left alone. And if he needed me to do something, telling me to do it was the worst. Let me come to my own conclusion. Because I was full of piss and vinegar, man.

[00:37:29.79] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, totally.

[00:37:30.80] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And he gave me the freedom to flex my marketing muscles and all that. I probably did it for about three years too long. I started there in 2013, 11 days after my daughter was born.

[00:37:49.33] In 2017, Scott and I started the podcast. Naturally, our podcast guests were independent agents because independent agents traditionally are more likely to share. Independent agents tend to have somewhat of an abundance mindset, whereas captive agents it's like, you're always fighting with the company to some degree, so you got to keep your--

[00:38:13.70] And so we interviewed a lot of independent agents through the podcast, got in some rooms that I probably didn't deserve to be in through that, and really learned the ropes through the podcast.

[00:38:29.64] And I was dealing with a lot of issues at Alfa because the culture was terrible. You know those nightmares you have that you're back in high school? I have those same nightmares, but I'm back at Alfa.

[00:38:40.71] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[00:38:41.57] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You know? Literally. I'm not joking at all. My wife asked me the other night. We had to fly to Arkansas. We got up at 4:00 AM and she's like, man, you really slept bad last night, didn't you? I was like, I had those dreams again. She's like, the Alfa dreams? I'm like, yep. That was just a lot of-- dude, I could sit here all day and tell you stories and you'd be like, no way that happened. I'd be like, yeah, that happened.

[00:39:05.46] But I was like, I think I want to start an independent agency. And through the podcast, I had a lot of relationships that helped accelerate that. I was probably the most prepared person in the history of the United States of America to start an independent agency. So me and my wife, we don't do it. We didn't do it last year. But typically, every December, we rent a cabin somewhere in the woods and we do business planning for two days.

[00:39:32.66] She's in her room. I'm in my room. It's just a thing or whatever. It's also a nice write-off. And I was doing some planning and we met up for dinner that night, and she's like, do you think you just want to go ahead and do it? And this was December the 29th. I was like, yeah, I do. And she's like, well, why don't you go back on Monday and quit? And I was like, well, I get paid on January the 7th, so why don't I quit on the 8th?

[00:39:59.10] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[00:39:59.75] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So I got paid. I quit the next day.

[00:40:02.37] REID HOLZWORTH: Wow.

[00:40:03.16] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And then Portal was born March the 1st of 2019. And rock and roll, man. That's how Portal started. It's a completely different business today than what we started. I think it's harder today than when I started. And we've grown it. I think we're at 15 employees. I think the magazine came out a couple of weeks ago. We were in the top 20 in the state of Alabama in terms of book size and that sort of thing. I don't put a lot of weight into that, but it is nice to look back and see.

[00:40:37.39] We started in a little concrete block building that was next to a pizza shop. And it wasn't even a good pizza shop. It was Little Caesars. And so every day it smelled like pizza. And to what it is now. And so yeah, that's what we are now.

[00:40:55.82] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome, man. What makes your agency different than others?

[00:41:02.93] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Several things. Not compared to the people that you and I know, but definitely compared to the competition around here.

[00:41:10.15] REID HOLZWORTH: Right. Yeah, fair enough, yeah.

[00:41:11.54] BRADLEY FLOWERS: We use a lot of technology that enhances the customer experience. A lot of technology that enhances the customer experience that the customer doesn't even know about that happens on the back end that allows us to be more efficient. An example, I spoke to a group of 400 agency owners in Alabama, and I asked them, who here is using a CRM that is not your agency management system? That many hands went up. Yeah.

[00:41:42.87] Zero, zero. One of my employees was in the crowd, and I was like, we're going to kick their butts so much. Because it gives us such an advantage just from managing policy. So the technology aspect, I think some of my relationships in the industry, we are-- most new carriers that have come to this area, we get them first. We're the first agency in Alabama appointed with GEICO.

[00:42:11.98] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, nice. That's awesome.

[00:42:13.74] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Openly, it was another. I look at carriers and technology almost buying stocks. You buy low, you sell high. You buy it early. The quicker you can get in. And there's been some duds in there too, you know. So that's a huge advantage. I think our focus on-- we focus heavily on culture. And do people want to be here? I want people who want to be here. I don't want people that want a job.

[00:42:38.08] I think we're in tune with a lot of things that a lot of other agencies are not. But at the same time, we're not special. And our sort of North Star, the thing that we are all collectively looking at is we want to redefine the way an independent agency operates. We want to set the standard for the future, the agency of the future, for lack of a better term.

[00:43:05.02] And that's not an egotistical thing. I don't say that to be grandiose or anything, but that's our-- I have a sign in here that says "we are not here to do what has already been done."

[00:43:19.80] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:43:21.21] BRADLEY FLOWERS: That's our thing, man.

[00:43:23.73] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome, man. That's awesome.

[00:43:26.40] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And by the way, we screw up a lot. We got a lot of issues. Everybody has a lot of issues. Everybody has a lot of issues. The business that doesn't have any issues doesn't exist.

[00:43:38.69] I was recruiting someone recently, a producer from another agency, and she was complaining to me about all the issues. And the agency owner wouldn't address them, and this and that, and the other. And I said, here's the thing. Every single issue you just ran by me, we have had too. The difference is we fix it.

[00:43:57.52] Like, if sombeody comes to me with a problem, we immediately jump in and fix it. And one of my people on my leadership team, Tuesday, came to me, and she's like, I think we have a problem with consistency. Especially some producers. They're wanting to work really, really hard for two weeks out of the month and then slack off. I'm like, I would rather you be a little bit less productive and be consistent because it's going to make your life easier because you're commissioned and your pay is going to-- that whole thing. And so that was Tuesday.

[00:44:28.66] This morning, we had a big pep talk company-wide. All hands on. I riffed on consistency and that sort of thing. So we see a problem, and we jump to fix it.

[00:44:41.25] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. Quick question. You're talking about Alabama. I mean, we may have talked about this before, but do you know Boyd McGee? Talladega Insurance?

[00:44:49.79] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Man, I have heard the name a bunch. I do not know him. I know Cass big buddies with him.

[00:44:55.59] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. Oh, yeah, Cass and him go way back. 100%.

[00:44:58.72] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yes.

[00:44:59.00] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, yeah. Boyd used to be pretty involved in the industry. Unfortunately, his dad passed away. He took over the agency. He's been just doing his thing for a while.

[00:45:07.89] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:45:08.55] REID HOLZWORTH: But I don't know if you've seen him.

[00:45:11.02] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Talladega is one of those places you need a helicopter to get to from where I'm at. It's way away.

[00:45:17.81] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, OK, yeah.

[00:45:18.80] BRADLEY FLOWERS: If you look at Alabama, I'm down all the way down by the beach. I'm at the bottom. I'm basically Northwest-- yeah, Northwest Florida. I'm almost Florida. And Alabama is very segmented, especially from the Big Eye, like all that stuff, There's almost like a line that goes through Birmingham. Everybody north of there might as well be in another state.

[00:45:41.63] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. Yeah, totally.

[00:45:45.04] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But yeah. So I don't know him, man. I don't know him. I've heard a lot about him, though. And I think that was happening with his dad around the time we started Portal. I think he and I--

[00:45:54.79] REID HOLZWORTH: That's probably about right. Yeah. I'd say, that's about right, yeah. He used to run the Young Agents Association or something. He was pretty involved. He's a good dude, man. Me, him, and Todd are actually is one of his boys. We did a big hike out in the Quinault many, many years ago, and Boyd almost died of hypothermia. For real. A story for another day.

[00:46:18.48] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Wow.

[00:46:19.00] REID HOLZWORTH: It's crazy. So I know that dude. It's fun. I like seeing him around. He's a good dude.

[00:46:22.39] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Now I'm curious to know. I've got some cousins whose last names are McGee, so we might even be related. But it's Alabama, dude. You got to be careful, man. You got to be careful. You may start dating somebody, and the next thing you know, you find out they're your cousin. That's the whole cliche Alabama thing.

[00:46:41.09] REID HOLZWORTH: So your podcast is very popular. Lots of fans. You talk to a lot of people, interview a lot of folks across the whole industry. If you could fix something in our industry, what would it be? One thing.

[00:46:56.36] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I'm not going to give the cliche technology answer. We do a lot of ENS business. If I could wave a magic-- and I know there's reasons that it's that way. But if I could wave the magic wand, I would eliminate all the big wholesalers and go direct to those carriers.

[00:47:16.76] REID HOLZWORTH: Interesting.

[00:47:17.52] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Because a lot of times, if we're writing-- we do a lot of condo associations. I'm sending it to an underwriter who's sending it to an underwriter, who's sending it to an underwriter.

[00:47:26.84] REID HOLZWORTH: Right, yeah.

[00:47:31.49] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So you add all those people in the process, it just--- it delays things. It leaves room for error. This person's got to get their piece of commission. This person's got to get their piece of commission. This person's got to get theirs. And ultimately, that trickles down to the consumer. And also, you have some of the large wholesalers. The tail wags the dog a little bit.

[00:48:01.27] REID HOLZWORTH: Mm-hmm.

[00:48:02.22] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You know?

[00:48:03.11] [DOG BARKS]

[00:48:04.28] That was perfect timing, by the way.

[00:48:06.30] REID HOLZWORTH: It scared me.

[00:48:06.99] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It was perfect. The tail wags the dog. Your dog agreed with that. Please leave that in the podcast.

[00:48:12.69] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[00:48:13.89] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So a lot of these carriers, man, even talking about the MGAs and the whole-- even talking about IVANS Downloads. There's no reason why the largest wholesaler in the world does not download to IVANS. But hey, we've got all these exclusive contracts with these carriers. Why do we have to update our technology?

[00:48:37.77] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:48:38.93] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It's like, there's a restaurant down the street from me that is the number one burger in the state of Alabama that's very popular and the customer service is horrible. And I can't help but think the attitude is like, we've got the best burger in Alabama, why do we have to be good at customer-- you know what I'm saying?

[00:48:55.96] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, no, totally.

[00:48:56.87] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And you can't be entitled to your success. And so I think if I could wave a magic wand, I would fix that. And I know that there are reasons it is the way that it is. So if you're a wholesaler listening to this, please don't cancel my contract or anything.

[00:49:09.88] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[00:49:10.24] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But I would severely-- there's a guy here named Taylor Norton who's got a local wholesaler that downloads to IVANS and pushes the envelope tech. I respect those guys so much because they're trying to do things differently. So I think that would be it, man. I think that would have the biggest impact on the industry and ultimately help the consumer the most as well.

[00:49:32.00] REID HOLZWORTH: By the way, for the listeners and yourself as well, a lot of those big wholesalers are going live on IVANS. We've actually sold a lot of them, but they're all going through implementation. So it's coming.

[00:49:41.75] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:49:42.69] REID HOLZWORTH: It's coming. But yeah. No, that's interesting, man. That's interesting. So what technology do you see having the greatest impact on the industry in the next couple of years?

[00:49:54.13] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Anything that eliminates multiple entry.

[00:49:56.98] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:49:57.80] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I don't know if you heard my talk at Cass's thing two weeks ago, but that's my North Star if we're going to use any technology is, does this eliminate entry or create entry? I don't know if you want me to give actual shoutouts, but I look at GAIA. That's what they do is eliminate entry. Anything from that aspect-- IVANS-- anything that eliminates entry is what I'm the most excited about. Because the thing is, if you take an agent-- when we were $1 million in premium, it didn't really matter that we had to enter information in a separate field, right?

[00:50:42.48] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:50:42.82] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And then as you grow, as you grow, as you grow, those problems are magnified. We're going to be probably right around or above $2 million in revenue this year when the year closes, which is a lot smaller than a lot of other agencies. But we've grown really fast. We've done that in five years. And so now it's like, OK, if I add this one extra program, now everybody's got to enter.

[00:51:07.15] It magnifies things. It's just like if you're signing up for a contract with an e-signature provider, yeah, when you got two employees, $10 a seat, no big deal. But when you have 20, it starts adding up. And that's how I look at inefficiencies and that sort of thing. Now, the flip side is because the inefficiencies are magnified, it's easier to spot them. But that's anything that eliminates multiple entry. Whether they want to call it AI or it does some kind of AI thing, I think overall a net positive for the industry.

[00:51:42.80] And also, if you look from a competitive standpoint, man, if somebody calls me and then they call a State Farm agent, that State Farm agent may not have to enter anything in the system. From just a competition standpoint, if I as an independent agent have to enter the client data here, and then I have to enter it here, and I have to enter it here, and I have to enter it here, by the time I get to where I can quote it, the damn State Farm agents got the quote back to them.

[00:52:07.97] REID HOLZWORTH: Right.

[00:52:08.71] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And so just from that. I mean, the biggest way to increase your closing ratio is speed to quote. And so anything we can do to eliminate that is that's my jam, man. That's probably the one thing from a technology standpoint I've focused on the most.

[00:52:25.51] REID HOLZWORTH: That makes total sense. I love how simple you put it, too. It's so true.

[00:52:30.12] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I've wasted a lot of money myself trying to build stuff and trying vendors that I thought would solve it that just didn't, you know.

[00:52:39.60] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome. Any advice you'd give to young entrepreneurs coming into the space on the technology side? You know, we'll do this. On the agency side and maybe on the technology side.

[00:52:50.55] BRADLEY FLOWERS: All right, let's do technology first. Don't alienate your competition.

[00:52:55.97] REID HOLZWORTH: What do you mean by that?

[00:52:57.95] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I've seen some companies come in the last few years that they want to be brash and cocky.

[00:53:06.88] REID HOLZWORTH: Get up on stage and talk a ton of shit about the incumbents? [CHUCKLES]

[00:53:11.44] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Exactly. Exactly. That's actually exactly what I said at Cass's conference.

[00:53:19.36] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:53:21.09] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And they do that to get attention, and that's great. I respect that. I think an appropriate level of shade is OK, right?

[00:53:31.27] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, totally.

[00:53:32.50] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But the problem is it's hard to build an all-in-one solution from scratch. Very hard. And it's going to take 10 years.

[00:53:45.89] REID HOLZWORTH: It takes a long time. It takes a long time. And I don't care what any of you say. It takes a long time.

[00:53:51.50] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It does. You've got to play nice with your competition. You can't pull the whole Silicon Valley thing where you come in and just are like super aggressive towards your competition. Because in order for people to use your solution, it has to work with your competition.

[00:54:09.49] REID HOLZWORTH: Yep.

[00:54:10.19] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Right? You're decreasing your TAM substantially by doing that. I think that's the biggest mistake I see a lot of insurtechs make. The other one, the other mistake I see insurtechs make is-- because a lot of these guys and gals are coming from outside the industry, and they think they know everything, right? But you might. That's fine.

[00:54:30.36] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, they might be way smarter than we are in many ways.

[00:54:32.93] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You've got to have some agents in your corner. You've got to have some people who are in the business that are in your corner. One of the smartest things that I've seen is insurtechs that build an agent's advisory council that comes with some equity or something. They're bought in. The agents have their ear. And it's like, hey, you need to try this. You need to do this.

[00:54:56.03] REID HOLZWORTH: But they're blind partners. They're the thought leaders around how they're molding the product and whatnot.

[00:55:01.34] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah. Well, like Ascend, I was involved in very early. And their thing was is they didn't want to be just a premium finance company. And they're not just a premium finance company. But I told them, if you don't call yourself a premium finance company, nobody's going to know what you do.

[00:55:14.43] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[00:55:15.80] BRADLEY FLOWERS: The way you deliver that message. So different things like that. And then it's very easy, I think, in insuretech to create problems that don't exist and try to solve those problems, and they don't exist. And so I think that's where having somebody who's in the industry helps tremendously.

[00:55:32.60] The other side of the question is people who want to start insurance agencies. It's way harder than you think it's going to be. It's not easy at all would probably be my biggest answer. There's been some guys that are big-time entrepreneurs, and these Holdco guys that I've seen on Twitter and stuff that are starting insurance agents. And I'm like, man, this isn't a insurance.

[00:55:58.49] Just because the money functions like a passive investment rental property, it is not a passive investment rental property. It's a business you have to work in. And if you don't have somebody on your side that's done it before and that sort, it's not-- this is not a passive investment type of business. You know what I mean?

[00:56:16.88] REID HOLZWORTH: They're blind, dude. There's a lot of work that goes into it, especially on the service side, you know?

[00:56:21.88] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:56:22.18] REID HOLZWORTH: I mean, it is not easy. Not easy.

[00:56:25.76] BRADLEY FLOWERS: No, not at all. And the carriers are what makes it hard. If you had one carrier, it'd probably be fine.

[00:56:34.00] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, totally. Right, yeah.

[00:56:35.41] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And not to say that that's not hard, but that's where it gets complicated.

[00:56:42.20] REID HOLZWORTH: It's learning all the portals. It's all the different flavors. It's all the different appetites. It's just, yeah.

[00:56:47.72] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It looks like whack-a-mole. This carrier does this that creates a problem over here. So we're getting to the point now to where-- even from a billing standpoint, man, every carrier does it differently. And so you've got to remember, this one does it this way, this one does it this way, and that sort of thing. That would be my advice is like, it's going to be a lot harder than you think.

[00:57:07.33] And honestly, man, I've been telling a lot of people that have been reaching out to me, especially if they're coming from outside the industry and they're thinking about starting an agency. I've been telling them, go to work for an agency.

[00:57:17.95] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, totally.

[00:57:18.96] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Do that.

[00:57:19.48] REID HOLZWORTH: [INAUDIBLE] learn it, yeah.

[00:57:20.71] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And do it under the premise of, hey, I'm going to open my own agency one day. If you do that, I think that person's going to be a lot more inclined to help you. And honestly, I've got a couple people here. I've got one for sure that came to me, and she said, I want to start my own agency, but I want to learn from you. And I'm like, OK, that's cool. As long as we do it above board, I'm fine with that.

[00:57:39.31] And then she worked here for six months, and she's like, I don't want to own my own agency. I'm like, that's what you get exactly.

[00:57:45.07] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[00:57:46.62] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So.

[00:57:47.25] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, that's awesome, man. Well, thank you for that. I used to have a lot of young startup agencies come to me at my TechCanary days, and one of the things I found is-- and I might have spoken on this podcast before, but I found a lot of people can be very entrepreneurial where they want to build out the prettiest, best system and have the best technology and all of that before they start closing deals.

[00:58:16.13] And I used to be like, I'm not going to sell to you. Go get a fricking Trapper Keeper and a number two pencil right now and go start closing some deals, man. You'll figure it out.

[00:58:25.67] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You know what we started with? An agency management system, Formstack for e-signatures, and a phone.

[00:58:34.09] REID HOLZWORTH: There you go.

[00:58:34.72] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And by the way, I've done the podcast. I knew Torey at Rocket Referrals, and I know you, and I knew all these folks. I had access to all that stuff and knew about all the cool customer experience stuff. I went up to Paradiso's office and learned about it. I was like, we're not doing any of that stuff. We got to get this bad boy profitable because I can give the best customer experience in the world. If we can't sell insurance, then none of that matters.

[00:58:58.70] REID HOLZWORTH: That's exactly right.

[00:58:59.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And that's a mistake. I think, I see a lot of folks make is they go and they-- especially if you're coming from Captive because you're told what you can do. And now, the world is my oyster. I can sign up for anything, and there's not a compliance department that tells me I can't use a text message platform or something. So that was our thing initially is, man, like, what do we need to sell insurance? And then we'll slowly layer on that other stuff.

[00:59:23.12] The other version of it that I've seen that Scott actually did is he actually signed up with every platform in the world but then whittled it down to what he needed. He was like, hey, we're going to try everything, and then we're going to go back to what we actually need. And I think that's smart, as long as you have the discipline to get rid of stuff.

[00:59:43.74] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, totally, totally. And you really have the time to really vet all those out, too.

[00:59:49.25] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[00:59:50.19] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. And the money, because that can be pretty expensive.

[00:59:53.04] BRADLEY FLOWERS: They can be very expensive.

[00:59:55.70] REID HOLZWORTH: That's cool, man. Let's transition to some other topics. Let's talk about leadership real quick, if that's OK.

[01:00:01.61] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Absolutely.

[01:00:02.33] REID HOLZWORTH: What does a leader mean to you?

[01:00:05.55] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I think the best definition of a leader, a true leader is a Simon Sinek definition is, people tend to think the leader is the one that's in charge, but the leader is really the one that takes care of others in their charge. I've always looked at it like my people work for the customers, and I work for them.

[01:00:26.41] My job is to make sure they are good and they have what they need to do the job. And my business philosophy is hire great people, pay them well, give them the tech and processes to do their job the most efficiently. Rinse and repeat. If somebody brought me into-- and I'm not saying that I'm right. That's the lens I look at it through.

[01:00:49.00] If somebody brought me in their company, that's what we're going to look at. We're going to look at your people. We're going to look at your processes. We're going to look at your comp. And then once we get that right, we're just going to do that over and over and over and over and over again. That's what I do here.

[01:01:01.63] And I could give you an example. Like Tuesday, I had a really busy day. I had an employee walk in my office crying. I had a problem. Clear the schedule. Let's go to lunch. Let's go talk about it somewhere else. I think dropping what you're doing because I am here to serve these people, I think.

[01:01:25.42] And now, by the way, I think I'm like a 4 out of 10 liter. I don't think I'm great, but at least I know that. You know what I mean? If you know you're not a good singer, you're way better off than if you think you're a good singer and you're not, you know? But I think that I'll go ahead and say this now because I don't know the next question. It's really easy to be a leader of a team of three. It's really easy to be a leader of a team of five. But as you get more and more people, you yourself have to progress and learn yourself.

[01:01:58.98] OK, how do I lead a team of 15? How do I lead a team of 20? How do I lead a team of 50? And by the way, if one day we're at 50 employees, I'm going to be like, damn, it was really easy when I had 15. And I think it's really hard right now. And so I think it's constantly improving. Like, you've got some cool cars back there. You and I could take that red car. I think that's a convertible, right?

[01:02:21.04] REID HOLZWORTH: No, it's not. It's not.

[01:02:22.30] BRADLEY FLOWERS: All right. We take that red car and drive it down the road. I could drive it. No problem, right?

[01:02:28.01] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:02:29.35] BRADLEY FLOWERS: If we get in a NASCAR stock car, it's still driving, but it's a lot harder.

[01:02:36.65] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:02:37.33] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And that's how I look at leadership. As your company grows, you have to then progress your own skills. And I'm constantly trying to learn, and read books, and listen to podcasts and YouTube videos to try to improve my leadership skills. So I don't think you can be a good leader and just sit on that and be like, this is a skill that I have. I'm a good leader. I think you constantly have to grow with it.

[01:03:00.96] There's a couple of entrepreneurs here locally that I'm a big fan of that I'm friends with that are just really good leaders of their team. And if I had to pinpoint one thing, that's what they do well. They take care of the people that are in their charge.

[01:03:17.67] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, yeah.

[01:03:19.06] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And sometimes that comes with tough decisions. I told Carrie Wallace yesterday, I was like, I feel like a politician now because no matter what decision I make, it's going to piss off half the people.

[01:03:27.73] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[01:03:28.86] BRADLEY FLOWERS: When you're three people, it's really easy to make a decision that makes everybody happy.

[01:03:32.95] REID HOLZWORTH: Right. Oh, absolutely.

[01:03:34.18] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You know?

[01:03:35.18] REID HOLZWORTH: Absolutely. Well, you obviously consider yourself a leader. At what point in your career did you realize? Or not even career. At what point in your life did you realize that you're a leader?

[01:03:45.07] BRADLEY FLOWERS: [TRILLS] I mean, probably the day we started Portal. I'm not going to say I realized I was a leader. I realized I had to be one.

[01:03:53.85] REID HOLZWORTH: Right?

[01:03:54.77] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You know? That was it. But honestly, that's what I wanted to do. I wanted to have a team of people and lead those people, and that sort of thing. I don't know that I would ever call myself that.

[01:04:08.52] REID HOLZWORTH: Do you consider yourself a leader?

[01:04:10.83] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I mean, I do, because I have to be. Like I said earlier, I mean, I consider myself a 4 out of 10 just because we've stepped it up and I've now had to improve myself as a leader. I think my team would probably not rank me 4 out of 10. I think I'm harder on myself than they are.

[01:04:33.49] REID HOLZWORTH: Put you pretty high, yeah.

[01:04:35.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, I would love for somebody to really call them out and be like, all right, tell me. And I've even had conversations with some of my people here and said, hey, look, I want you to be brutally honest with me. Nothing that you say is going to get you fired. Tell me where I'm lacking.

[01:04:49.00] REID HOLZWORTH: You should do a quantitative 360. I've done those before where they actually-- somebody comes in, a third party, they interview the whole team and they give you the feedback, you know? It's pretty eye-opening.

[01:04:59.36] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[01:04:59.89] REID HOLZWORTH: I recommend that to everybody.

[01:05:03.17] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I will say this, Reid. I've had some bad bosses in the past. The a-hole boss, you know? I'm more empathetic to them now than I was then because I've realized how hard it is to tote that line of everybody liking you versus being an a-hole. You know what I mean?

[01:05:28.05] I'm way more empathetic to my last boss, who managed 45 people. I'm like, oh, that's why he did that thing he did. He really wasn't being a jerk. You know what I mean?

[01:05:37.61] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:05:38.49] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But now, I will say I did take away a lot from my last two bosses that are like, OK, here's what I don't want to do. You know what I mean?

[01:05:46.52] REID HOLZWORTH: Totally. Totally, man. All right. What is the most important trait a leader should have?

[01:05:53.24] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Probably decision-making skills.

[01:05:55.61] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:05:56.81] BRADLEY FLOWERS: If you look at Jeff Bezos, Jeff Bezos has said many, many times that what he gets paid to do is make high-level decisions really fast. I think it's that. I also think it's network who can help you make those decisions. Natasha, our director of sales, came into my office a couple of weeks ago. I'm blessed with a great network. And she came to me with a problem that we hadn't dealt with before.

[01:06:25.14] And I leaned back in my chair, and I didn't say anything. And normally, you can't shut me up. And she's like, what are you doing? And I said, I'm going through my mental Rolodex to think who has dealt with this problem before. And I made two phone calls, and I found somebody who had dealt with it before, and they told us how to solve it.

[01:06:46.83] So I think, being humble enough to be able to say, I don't know how to solve this problem. Let me talk to somebody. I know an agency owner. I know a former agency owner who failed, who was too prideful to ask people for help. And that's why he failed. I tell all new agency owners, have someone that you're not scared to ask stupid questions to.

[01:07:19.19] I had a guy. Unfortunately, he's passed away. But literally, that first year in business, I would call him, and he would literally answer the phone, insurance agency hotline, because he got tired of me calling him so much. I'd be like, hey, man, how do I do this thing? So yeah.

[01:07:37.28] REID HOLZWORTH: How do you define success? What does success mean to you?

[01:07:40.37] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Being able to do what I want to do when I want to do it. To dovetail that in. What? for me personally, I like playing the game of business for the love of playing the game.

[01:07:54.19] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:07:54.73] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I don't want to play the game of business because I have to make money.

[01:07:59.19] - Oh, totally. Right. The money will come to you if you play it that way.

[01:08:03.37] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I want to be able to play it because I like playing it. And so when I get to the point financially that I can do that, that's when I will consider myself truly a success. I've got a buddy who is really a successful entrepreneur. If I said his name, a lot of people would know it.

[01:08:21.74] And that's kind of where he's at. He's financially set, so he gets to do stuff that he wants to do, whether it's investing in a company just to help them because it looks like a fun thing to do or travel to some-- to me, those are the folks that are truly successful. And they have a great home life.

[01:08:43.15] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, fair enough.

[01:08:43.93] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Because you can-- man, you can be all the business success in the world, if you lose your family in the process or vice versa. You got to do both. Not that we've had any issues or anything, but that's been something I've had to realize. I get frustrated sometimes because a kid gets sick, and it knocks me out of the game for a week or whatever.

[01:09:10.38] And I was watching a video of Jamie Dimon. And I think Jamie's 60 years old now. And he was going through his morning routine, and I was like, I can't do any of that because I get up, I got to change diapers, and make lunches for the day, and stuff. And I was like, man, I'm going to be a badass when these kids are grown. So why don't I just accept a little bit less business growth now to have a little bit more balance with the family life and I'm good?

[01:09:34.61] So I think you have to-- The Bible verse is like-- I think it's a Bible verse. I apologize if it's not. But it does a man no good to gain the world and lose his soul. You got to cover both bases. So.

[01:09:50.25] REID HOLZWORTH: Well said. Well said. Do you give back? If so, how do you give back?

[01:09:56.08] BRADLEY FLOWERS: A couple of ways. I mean, obviously, I feel like I give back a lot to the-- I call it insurance land. Whether it's--

[01:10:03.45] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah, 100%.

[01:10:04.29] BRADLEY FLOWERS: --podcasts, helping agents. I do them once a month. Hey, ask me anything call. So I've always had agents reach out to me and ask for an hour of my time, and unfortunately, I don't have it right now.

[01:10:17.11] And so what we're doing is I'm doing a once a month ask me anything call, where I have anywhere from 10 to 30 agents on there where we're just spitting out. And it's more of a group thing. It's not the Bradley Flowers Show that people are doing. The link, if you want me to drop it, is portalinsurance.com/ama. You know, I love helping people.

[01:10:41.37] Back to me reaching out to that mentor that's dealt with that problem. I love helping people with their problems. From a charity aspect, my wife is very charitable. She's involved in a lot of stuff. It was funny. We both did a DISC assessment with this consultant. And she looked at hers, and she looked at mine, and she said, here's the biggest difference in you two. She said she is very likely to donate her time to a charity. You are very likely to donate your money to a charity and not your time. And I was like, sister, you hit the nail on the head.

[01:11:21.96] So between the two of us, we do pretty well with that. We give back. We tithe, and we donate to people who are doing mission work in Africa, and then anything here locally, any time I see something that touches my heart. Our friend Raghav Tanna started The Little Sparks Project.

[01:11:43.23] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:11:44.70] BRADLEY FLOWERS: It was near and dear to my heart. Those Little Sparks, they help parents who have kids who are going through medical stuff. My youngest son was in the hospital for two weeks. The longest two weeks of my life. Thankfully, he's OK. And I just remember thinking the whole time. Luckily, my wife and I have the means and the type of job where we can be away for two weeks if we need to. But there's a lot of people there that didn't. Like, the number of kids in that hospital that had no parents with them throughout the day because the parents had to work was just heartbreaking.

[01:12:11.99] I'm talking young kids. And so we raised recently about, I think, $9,000 for Little Sparks. I was like, hey, I don't know how to do much, but there's a few business skills that I have. And so I did a webinar on recruiting that was $99. And so I was able to do something that I liked while also raising money for charity. So little ways like that.

[01:12:44.60] You know, there's certain people that everything they do runs through the altruistic filter. I'm not one of those people, but I eventually make my way there, you know.

[01:12:56.11] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah. That's awesome, man. I didn't realize that you were donating to Raghav's Little Sparks. That's pretty cool. For the listeners that don't know that. Raghav Tanna is the founder of Tarmika. It now runs all the commercial lines at Applied on the tech side. Raghav is a great dude. He's been on maybe even a couple of times now. He's having an event soon. It's coming up in a couple of weeks.

[01:13:18.01] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I'm going to be there. It's in December. It's in December.

[01:13:20.00] REID HOLZWORTH: OK, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[01:13:20.84] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I'm going to be there. It's in Boston. You can still get tickets now.

[01:13:23.69] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, yeah.

[01:13:26.66] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Actually, man, when we started Portal, we had no commercial appointments. Raghav wanted me on Tarmika. I'm like, bro, I don't have any commercial appointments. He actually got me my first three or four commercial appointments.

[01:13:38.19] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, no kidding.

[01:13:39.29] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[01:13:39.39] REID HOLZWORTH: Wow!

[01:13:39.76] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, I owe a lot to that guy, man.

[01:13:42.50] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome.

[01:13:44.14] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I think the first commercial policy we wrote was Liberty Mutual. And Raghav got me that appointment. And he basically called these carriers and was like, I want this agent on Tarmika, and he needs your-- and I was like, all right, cool.

[01:13:55.72] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES] Wow, that's awesome, man.

[01:13:59.30] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[01:13:59.51] REID HOLZWORTH: That's super cool you do that. So aside from family-- I always ask aside from family, because we all have families, we all have kids. We're all busy with all that stuff. What do you do for fun?

[01:14:09.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: All right, I'm going to tell you. So I'm not a gamer.

[01:14:15.07] REID HOLZWORTH: OK.

[01:14:15.56] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I'm not, OK? But I played GoldenEye 007 on the Nintendo 64. That was the only game I played growing up.

[01:14:22.64] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[01:14:24.73] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I bought an Oculus about two years ago, OK? And there's a game on there called Golf+. It is a VR golf game. It's the closest thing to real golf that I've ever seen. I play that every night for 20 minutes before I go to bed. You can play 10 holes in 20 minutes.

[01:14:46.31] REID HOLZWORTH: No kidding. Wow!

[01:14:48.10] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And maybe I have missed two nights in the last two years. And I made it up to number two in the world on that game, actually.

[01:14:58.60] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[01:14:59.44] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I would just get on there because it's a bunch of video game nerds that play it. But I actually know how to play golf from a course management standpoint. And so I have a little bit of a leg up. And I would just get on there every night for 20 minutes and just whip some 15-year olds' butt.

[01:15:19.18] That's honestly like, man, outside of family stuff, I love doing that. I don't take it overboard, and I'm not leaving work to go play it. But that's my way to just relax for 20 minutes before I go to bed. And I'm sure, like, the Blue Light Therapy, people are going to be like, oh, you don't need to put that on your face right before bed.

[01:15:42.41] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[01:15:43.01] BRADLEY FLOWERS: But that's what I like doing. Honestly, it helps me sleep better. I'm super competitive, so that's fun. Outside of that man, my favorite thing in the world to do is to get a babysitter for the kids and go with my wife and grab dinner and a drink. I just love eating and fellowship from that standpoint.

[01:16:04.82] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah, that's awesome, man. That's awesome. If you had unlimited time, what would you do? And money, I guess.

[01:16:13.21] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, unlimited time. I would do exactly what I'm doing now. I would just do more of it. Unlimited money, I would leave this podcast right now and go buy a private jet.

[01:16:23.20] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS]

[01:16:25.39] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Right now.

[01:16:26.02] REID HOLZWORTH: Can I come?

[01:16:27.07] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Absolutely. Absolutely. And not from an Instagram flex standpoint. I mean, it's a time machine.

[01:16:35.83] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:16:38.45] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I've figured out that a $3 million jet would be a $1 million tax write-off. So as soon as I owe $1 million in taxes, I'm buying a little bitty, small $3 million jet. But I'm obviously half joking, but I did do the research on that. I just think if you think about the time we waste in the airports and the opportunities we missed because we can't be at this place and all that sort of stuff. But yeah, unlimited money. That's exactly what I would do.

[01:17:07.29] REID HOLZWORTH: That's awesome, man. That's awesome. All right, last question. Fourth question. Actually, I have one more question after this question.

[01:17:14.25] BRADLEY FLOWERS: OK.

[01:17:14.70] REID HOLZWORTH: Second to the last question. What's your favorite drink?

[01:17:18.23] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I like a whiskey, neat.

[01:17:20.31] REID HOLZWORTH: Whiskey, neat?

[01:17:21.19] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Mm-hmm. My favorite bourbon is either-- which is a cliché answer. I like Weller 107. That's a staple. There is a bottle on my shelf. I have a decent Bourbon collection. Nothing like Ragos, but I have a decent Bourbon collection. And if I showed it to you and said, which bottle up there is the tastiest bottle? The only way you'd be able to guess it is because there's three of them. But outside of that, you'd never guess it. It's a Jack Daniel's twice-barrel special release rye.

[01:17:57.99] REID HOLZWORTH: Mm.

[01:17:59.50] BRADLEY FLOWERS: You would never pick the Jack Daniels's. I mean, I've got Pappy Van Winkle. I've got Heaven Hill. All the good stuff. You would never pick the Jack Daniel's being the best. You'd be like, that's last. But yeah, just man, I like a whiskey, neat. And no ice, no water. Outside of that, I like old-fashioned. But I'd just rather have it neat.

[01:18:18.19] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:18:18.85] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So.

[01:18:20.02] REID HOLZWORTH: I was just at CIAB's ILF, the big conference whatever, and my friends at Liberty Mutual had a cocktail hour thing. And they had a Pappy tasting station, and they had all the way up to a 23.

[01:18:34.28] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Wow!

[01:18:35.01] REID HOLZWORTH: It's pretty wild. And they had this one. I forgot what it was, but it wasn't-- it was saying, but it was different, dude. It was so good. I've never done that, that high of one. I've done the lower years.

[01:18:45.22] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I enjoy the Bourbon Hunt.

[01:18:47.59] REID HOLZWORTH: Yeah.

[01:18:48.11] BRADLEY FLOWERS: I like the hunt, trying to find it. So Alabama is a controlled state, and so the state controls all of our liquor. And so they do a Bourbon drop. They do a small drop once a month. That's like Blanton's and Buffalo Trace, Eagle Rare. Stuff you can find. And then once a quarter is the hard to get stuff, and the annual one is at the end of the year. I showed up last year at 3 o'clock, and it started at 6:00 AM.

[01:19:17.66] I showed up at 3 o'clock, and I got a bottle that was so good. I traded it for a Pappy straight up. That was still some really good stuff left at 3 o'clock. So I don't miss the annual drop. Well, this year, me and my wife are going to be out of town.

[01:19:32.37] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, no.

[01:19:33.33] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I was like, hey, is there any way that we could push our trip? And she was like-- she gave me a look that I knew was the answer was no. So I was like, OK, all right. I'm big on delegating. So I walked out to one of my employees. I was like, hey. It's on December 14th. I was like, hey, how would you like to have the day off on December 13th?

[01:19:56.76] REID HOLZWORTH: [CHUCKLES]

[01:19:57.98] BRADLEY FLOWERS: She's like, what do you mean? I was like, well, I will give you the day off on December 13th. I will give you $100 cash. I'll give you my credit card, and you go stand in line at this Bourbon thing. And she was like, absolutely. Done. She's like, can I bring my husband, and you give us $200?

[01:20:14.58] I was like, I get double the bottles. I'm good. So who knows? Next year, man, I may bring a convoy of people with me. I like the hunt. And you know what? I don't know if you've ever been to any Bourbon drops, but you meet some people that have a lot of similar interests. And I've even sold some insurance in those because you stand in the line for an hour. And people are like, Portal insurance. What are you? I'm like, yeah, here's my card. And they give me a call. So I don't know if that makes it a tax write-off, but we'll try it.

[01:20:43.73] REID HOLZWORTH: Kind of.

[01:20:44.43] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah.

[01:20:45.22] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS] All right, last question. This question is really for me. Give me some tips on the best way to ride the mechanical bull.

[01:20:55.68] BRADLEY FLOWERS: All right, I'll tell you. I will tell you exactly. So mechanical bull is-- I think a real bull is easier.

[01:21:04.47] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, yeah?

[01:21:05.31] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Yeah, because those mechanical bulls, they can tilt them sideways. Like, stuff the real bull can't do. But let's pretend they couldn't do all that. The way you ride a bull or a mechanical bull is when-- I'll tell you also why I think a real bull is easier. So when the bull leans up, like, front legs up, you lean forward.

[01:21:28.07] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, OK.

[01:21:29.53] BRADLEY FLOWERS: When he kicks his back legs back, you lean back. That's how you do it. It's this, right?

[01:21:35.60] REID HOLZWORTH: Got it.

[01:21:36.71] BRADLEY FLOWERS: So it's counter to what the bull is doing. This is where the mechanical part gets harder. So what you have to do when you're riding a bull is you look at the back top of his neck. That's the best indication of which direction he's going to go.

[01:21:52.36] REID HOLZWORTH: Oh, OK.

[01:21:53.19] BRADLEY FLOWERS: And I've actually used this as an analogy for business. Like you've got to predict where the market's going and lean that way. But when he shifts to the left, you shift your weight to the left like this. Like that. So the arm up helps you. A lot of people think one hand on the bull makes it harder. It's actually harder to ride a bull holding on with two hands.

[01:22:12.97] It's one hand because you can shift that arm. So if he goes to the left, you shift to the left. If it goes to the right, you do this. You shift your arm over your head. So it's all about just counter-reacting to what the bull is doing and then guessing which direction it's going to go.

[01:22:28.72] What makes a mechanical bull harder is there's no neck. Only that operator knows where it's going, so you're really guessing at that point. So that's how you ride a bull, dude. It's just muscle memory. It's nothing to do with strength. Some of the best bull riders in the world are little, lanky guys.

[01:22:44.32] It's almost like skaters. It's little lanky guys that-- they have really good reflexes. So that's my bull-riding advice. I'm a trained professional, not responsible for any injuries that may come from that.

[01:22:57.62] REID HOLZWORTH: [LAUGHS] Well, man, this was really good, dude. Thank you so much for your time, and thank you for doing this. It was a lot of fun, man. And thank you for everything you do in the industry as well. And keep doing the good deed that you're doing. And everybody will see you out there. If you see Bradley out, get him a whiskey, neat.

[01:23:19.33] BRADLEY FLOWERS: There you go.

[01:23:20.14] REID HOLZWORTH: And something really good too. Very special.

[01:23:22.97] BRADLEY FLOWERS: Absolutely. I appreciate it, guys. See y'all.